From the Messenger Inquirer:
Will Craig retired from the Social Security Administration in December after 25 years.
He said he’s seen the problems people have in filing claims and appeals.
So Craig has started The Social Security Advisor, a business “where I can help people seeking guidance with Social Security-related issues, such as help with completing complex forms, filing appeals or just help filing their applications,” he said. “I’ve see how everything works. I can’t file claims, but I can help people fill them out correctly.”
Craig said when he worked at Social Security, “I had to get people in and out in 10 minutes. Often they said they wished they had more time to talk with me.”...
Craig charges $50 an hour for his services. ...
Craig’s website says, “People often feel that they don’t need an attorney to qualify for Social Security disability, but might still need help completing the piles of forms and questionnaires that the Disability Determination Service can send. Have you tried calling your local Social Security office to see if they can help? Most likely they told you that there is no one available or that you should seek help from a friend or family member. With 25 years of experience working for the Social Security Administration, I’ve assisted people just like you fill out those forms.”
I wish Mr. Craig all the best with his new business. I think this sort of service is needed. However, I think that Social Security is going to effectively shut it down by insisting on a fee petition for each fee he receives from a customer and that all monies he receives be held in escrow until a fee is approved. I have to say that this sort of thing -- where help is provided a Social Security claimant but there is no direct contact with Social Security -- has always been a gray area. I can't be entirely sure that Social Security will try to shut him down. I think it would not be in the public interest for them to shut him down. Why shouldn't it be legal to provide this sort of service if there's a demand for it? By the way, don't tell me that insisting that he file a fee petition to get paid isn't the same thing as shutting him down. Anyone who says that doesn't know how slow and tedious the fee petition process is. He would expend more effort filing fee petitions and following up on them than he would helping customers.
Ideally, there would be some kind of fee exception for non-legal work, or limited paralegal work. Or just waive need for fee petition for fees less than $200 (report via an easy 1 page form, somewhat like the Medicare "scope of appointment" for insurance agents)
ReplyDeleteThis type of service is desperately needed. The field offices I work with most often had a marked decline in service the last few years. I do not know how unrepresented claimants deal with some of the mistakes made by these offices--but this also presents a problem for his business model. Simply completing forms competently is not sufficient when SSA fails to properly apply their own regulations when processing said forms.
Hopefully Mr.Craig will see the post anyhow little the general population knows about SSA and line up some speaking engagements. It will educate the public, drum up business and his speaking fee does not have to be approved. I bet some local disability bars would be interested as well. Good luck Mr. Craig.
ReplyDeleteHopefully he was a good employee and gives people the right information.
ReplyDeleteIf he isn't a rep/attorney at the time he is helping them fill out paperwork, they have no jurisdiction over him. Unless I'm wrong, his fees are not covered by the regulations.
ReplyDeleteMaybe not. But his work may cross into the realm of unauthorized law practice. God help him if that comes to pass.
DeleteWhy is there any assumption he's going to notify SSA he's going to try to get paid from claimants? More likely than not he's going to require pay-as-you-go and SSA won't know. Even if they do, OGC won't do anything to him--he's not representative.
ReplyDeleteDamn, I'm retired and help people all the time. By helping them understand the law and regs, what activities of daily living are, what the disability listings are and how to ensue their submissions include what the DDS is looking for (if such evidence exists). But they do the paperwork and I never do more than help them figure things out. Represent them? Never. Talk to SSA? Never. Try to educate them and make them able to do things themselves, yes. So I respect someone monitizing this, but it wears the crap out of me so he's not charging enough.
ReplyDeleteI have been representing claimants for 38 years. Every week I speak with many referred by other attorneys who refuse to be bothered with overpayments, workers’ comp offset issues, and other post entitlement issues that will not result in past due benefits from which a fee can be paid. I know the problem; I know the answer. I explain the problem and the answer but I will not enter an appearance as a representative. Why? Because dealing with this agency is a nightmare. I have a business and employees to support not to mention a family.
ReplyDeletePotential clients beg me to represent them. “Why won’t you represent me? I am happy to pay”. Because I would have to work twice as hard and three times as long and would NEVER have any chance to get approved an appropriate fee for my time. So I give them 2 copies of a letter setting out the error with chapter and verse with regulation and POMS cites and I tell them to go into the DO and say “this is what I want”. Get the second copy stamped SSA received and mail a copy of THAT to their congressman.
This agency does not respect attorney representatives or the services we provide.
I’ll echo what everyone else has said. He’s not a representative. SSA has as much authority to interfere with his business idea as it does limiting the records fees providers charge reps and claimants.
ReplyDeleteGood for him for identifying a need and doing so cost effectively. If fee petitions are to be believed, he should be charging $150 to $200 per hour for this type of legal assistant work.
He may require money up front and not even mess with a fee petition.
ReplyDeleteTo be honest, I can't hate on this guy's idea. There's plenty of folks out there with literacy issues that don't understand the importance of function reports to their decision.
Ideally, it's something we'd have time to do in the field office for no charge. But we just can't hold everyone's hand through the process.
I'm all for it. Love how the SSA lets anybody represent someone in court. They just can't legally get paid for it unless they are an attorney or non-attorney rep. I'm all for allowing this service before the ALJ hearing level. This would help the SSA. And attorneys who get paid prior to the hearing level are just winning the lottery on a listing level case usually unless they are just some super great DDS arguer.
ReplyDeleteI do not recommend allowing a non-attorney get paid at the hearing level. That really is kind of unauthorized practice of law. Kind of like for any kind of non licensed work like accounting, plumbing, hair stylist, etc. They can do it without a license but they are there for a reason basically if someone really screws up.
It isnt rocket surgery. Not even close. ADRCs have been doing DIB apps, Medicare/Mediciad, LIS, and Retirement claim filing assistance for years, it is a free service (since they are funded by federal dollars), though the state has been contacted by SSA about a direct fee for doing more of these services.
ReplyDelete§404-1703: Murky waters here. "Representational services means services performed for a claimant in connection with any claim the claimant has before us, any asserted right the claimant may have for an initial or reconsidered determination, and any decision or action by an administrative law judge or the Appeals Council." BUT
ReplyDelete"Representative means an attorney who meets all of the requirements of § 404.1705(a), or a person other than an attorney who meets all of the requirements of § 404.1705(b), and whom you appoint to represent you in dealings with us."
So if he isn't appointed he can say he isn't a rep, but SSA could say he was engaging in Representational Services?
Dear God, people.
ReplyDeleteSSA certainlly could say he is providing representational services.
Whether they will or not is a separate question.
The real issue is the ban on taking fees and not getting approval from SSA.
We can argue about the wisdom of that all day, but this seems to fall under what is covered.
Otherwise too easy to evade.
My two cents worth
This is a needed and helpful service and with 25 years of experience Mr. Craig has the experience to give good advice. The problem to consider is what to do when a hack with no good experience starts charging people and giving them bad advice that harms them. SSA and state bar associations have disciplinary codes that deter that. What would deter those not subject to SSA or state bar discipline?
ReplyDeleteInteresting assumptions you’re making. I know dozens of extremely well-educated people with doctorates off all kinds at SSA who, despite their education and decades of experience, can’t even manage to fill out a simple check-box form properly. I wouldn’t trust those people to make me a bowl of cereal, let alone handle a Social Security claim for me.
DeleteSSA staff often turn away reps even with 1696s who want to help someone file a claim, on the grounds that there isn't a claim yet so there's nothing to attach the 1696 to and nothing for the rep to be working on. Under that line of thinking, it doesn't seem like this person is a rep and thus wouldn't be subject to the rules about fees. But I am guessing SSA will see it differently...
ReplyDeleteI don’t think this comes close to doing anything wrong. This doesn’t rise to the level of representation, merely filling out forms. Although that’s all that some reps do, that isn’t full representation. He isn’t going to the interview, isn’t going to hearings, isn’t submitting briefs etc. As long as he tells the claimants SSA will do the same thing for free he isn’t violating Section 1140. This is a direct fee for service, no different than if you paid someone to spellcheck your answers or had an advocate fill it out on your behalf.
ReplyDeleteI do not see anywhere in the article or on his web site that says he will act as an appointed representative. Helping someone understand the disability process and forms seems fine to me. I see no problem in him charging for his experience and knowledge. Disability and retirement are once in a lifetime events. Mosts lack this knowledge and need help.
ReplyDelete