From Outcomes Following Termination of Social Security Disability Insurance by Michael T. Anderson, Monica Farid, Serge Lukashanets, Denise Hoffman and Kai Filion:
... The paper found the following:
- Among people whose benefits terminated due to medical improvement from 2005 to 2014, 16 percent of former DI-only beneficiaries and 14 percent of former concurrent beneficiaries returned to DI within five years.
- Among people whose benefits terminated due to work from 2005 to 2014, 32 percent of former DI-only beneficiaries and 50 percent of former concurrent beneficiaries returned to DI within five years.
- Fewer than half of former beneficiaries whose benefits terminated due to medical improvement had average post-termination earnings above the poverty threshold. Those whose benefits terminated due to work were more likely to have post-termination earnings above the poverty threshold than those whose termination was due to medical improvement.
- Age and certain diagnoses were strongly associated with earnings below the poverty threshold and return to disability entitlement, especially schizophrenia and other psychotic disorders, and intellectual disabilities. ...
I think the attitude of many people can be summarized as "It's easy to get on Social Security disability. Except for the 'truly disabled' those drawing benefits are mostly lazy or just wusses who don't have the courage to overcome their disabilities and work. I'd never let that happen to me." That's the attitude among many of my clients who are themselves trying to get on Social Security disability benefits. Of course, they know themselves to be "truly disabled" without realizing that prior to becoming disabled they would have naively judged someone with their health problems to not be "truly disabled" because they didn't look sick enough. Often my clients have unrealistic expectations of their own ability to recover or overcome their disabilities and delay filing claims for disability benefits for years, until they become destitute, and then feel guilty about going ahead with a disability claim when they finally do.
This study demonstrates that it's damned difficult to get on Social Security benefits. Those who do should be recognized as "truly disabled." It should be acknowledged that they have little hope of ever again supporting themselves with work. However, we see proposal after proposal that purport to demonstrate a path for getting disability benefits recipients can be returned to work.
14 comments:
I struggle with is daily and for the last 25 years.
I can’t stop working because I have too many responsibilities and people depending on me to provide.
Also, after working for the agency, there’s no way in heck I’m depending on the government as my sole source of income.
At some point I’m sure I will hit rock bottom and this will all come crashing in on me. It’s just a matter of time.
Wonder if it is true when the economy is not in meltdown like it was during this study period? I also notice in all of the 30+ pages no mention if these people earned above poverty level when working.
The nice things about statistics is you can always manufacture some to support your position.
The problem is...even after 20, 25, 30 years of struggling to overcome your disabilities, when you do apply , because you can no longer will yourself through it... Will you get an ALJ just looking for an excuse to deny, or one who believes your plight? What may be "obvious to you," and anyone who knows you, may be oblivious to a skeptic just looking to "save the taxpayers " from those "not truly disabled." Death by 100 papercuts or the straw that broke the camel's back... These are real concepts that can be difficult for others to see. Even Tom Brady will no longer be able to do what he did at age 30. Sometimes you think you can still do (Unitas with the Chargers, Namath with the Rams) what you use to be able to do... At some point, no matter how much you try, you're just not capable of producing what you need to. Even with the easiest of jobs.
@12:20
The stated purpose of selecting 2005 to 2014 was to determine whether economic downturn impacts the outcomes of disabled folks returning to work, so your suspicion is misplaced.
20 years and I still hear "You don't look sick.". It's devastating to hear that. If only I had a bruise or a caved in head, maybe they'd understand.
In 2021, 19.1 percent of persons with a disability were employed, up from 17.9 percent in 2020, the. Bureau of Labor Statistics reported ...
https://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/disabl.pdf
@9:35
Page 5 of the report lists their definition of "disability," and it is a great deal broader than as defined by SSA. Sounds basically like they are defining "disability" as any "severe impairment," putting it in terms SSA uses.
9:35
What definition is DOL using? There are a lot of them, and most don't align fully with SSA's definition. I know a lot of disabled adults, mentally impaired primarily, working. Local food store workers, health care aid, vet assistant. Most not full time as most get SSI, most also DAC. None were functioning adults working who had some incident that disabled them. While they may be the "working disabled", most of them live in group settings, cannot live independently and have a lot of issues keeping them from things like driving, handling money independently. So does the statistic measure the latter or just that more of the former got part time jobs?
You like to throw all of us disabled people into the same pot and say we cannot work. As a disabled worker, severely disabled enough to meet both VA and SSA requirements for disability, I can tell you personally, that some of us can and do work every single day.
As angry as the disabled get when people think they are not disabled, trust me the disabled also get angry when everyone thinks we cannot work too.
Like the prior poster said, you can find a statistic to support any argument, and you can find a lawyer to file the suit for it too!
@3:38
If it's any comfort, SSA's definition of "work" (i.e. 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, earning SGA, etc.) is generally what people are referring to on this blog when they say disabled folks can't "work," because that's the definition of disability.
And if you are saying that people are doing that level of work activity while on disability benefits...I mean sure, no system is perfect, but once SSA catches it they are going to terminate benefits and seek an overpayment.
The problem is that the disability program is poorly designed, leaving out a huge section of Americans that could be classified as "the working disabled". SSA pays for people who essentially, in the long term, don't work. Trial work periods only last 9 months, and $1350 is not enough for essential living anymore.
They should provide immediate Medicare to people approved for SSDI, and let monetary benefits phase out with work over SGA like early retirement benefits do. If they work so much they don't get paid, they keep Medicare.
Sure, do medical CDRs on them every few years anyway just to keep Congress happy. But this way, people who need the additional safety net of SSDI or Medicare can contribute in meaningful amounts in the workplace.
I can’t speak to any other part of the country nor other DDS reviews but in my 15 years medical improvement cases for people allowed as adults are rare.
I’d guess I end up agreeing with DDS on those maybe as much as 40% of the time. In a few cases improvement is clearly established but even with improvement they remain disabled under a grid rule or simply cannot sustain 40 hours per week.
I recall a case where a beneficiary had been on disability 15 years, had to change primary care physicians. He was reviewing his file and said I think I know a neurosurgeon who can help you. Surgeon agreed to do surgery and the individual had pain free days for the first time in 18 years. Gets reviewed medical improvement was obvious and this person with no work history for nearly two decades and obsolete skills thanks to changing technology got foisted upon the workforce.
@12:20 said, "I also notice in all of the 30+ pages no mention if these people earned above poverty level when working.
The nice things about statistics is you can always manufacture some to support your position."
The paper covers workers who earn below the poverty threshold in the abstract, on page 1!
"Fewer than half of former beneficiaries whose benefits terminated due to medical improvement had average post-termination earnings above the poverty threshold. Those whose benefits terminated due to work were more likely to have post-termination earnings above the poverty threshold."
And the paper goes into detail multiple times thereafter.
1109 but no mention of earnings prior to disability. They may not have ever been earning above poverty level. I stand by my statement before.
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